tv PBS News Hour PBS October 26, 2015 3:00pm-4:00pm PDT
captioning sponsored by newshour productions, llc >> ifill: good evening. i'm gwen ifill. judy woodruff is away. on the newshour tonight: a powerful earthquake rocks afghanistan, rattling parts of pakistan and india as well. chaos on the streets, as the number of dead and injured climbs. also ahead, a meat lover's nightmare. the world health organization finds eating bacon, sausage, and other processed meats, can raise the risk of cancer. plus, secretary of education arne duncan on reducing the amount of testing in the nation's schools. >> we'll do things that are redundant or not helpful and waste time and energy. >> ifill: and, going beyond the headlines. what two teenagers' lives tell
us about the cycle of attacks in the middle east. >> all this playing out amid a surge of violence between palestinians and israelis. the story of naor and ahmed a microcosm of a wider narrative. >> ifill: all that and more on tonight's pbs newshour. >> major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: ♪ ♪ moving our economy for 160 years. bnsf, the engine that connects us.
>> and the william and flora hewlett foundation, helping people build immeasurably better lives. >> and with the ongoing support of these institutions >> this program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. >> ifill: the death toll is still climbing from the powerful earthquake that struck northeastern afghanistan much earlier today. at least 263 were killed, most of them in neighboring pakistan. the quake was centered deep under the hindu kush mountains, but at magnitude 7.5, its reach extended well into india.
independent television news has this report. a security camera captured the moment in someone's garage. and the news feed in the afghan capital kabul found himself unable to continue. several buildings in kabul crumbled, even though the epicenter of the quake was 400 kilometers to the north. >> that's because of the duration. >> we felt the earthquake. we tried to get out of the house. it was very big. the walls were destroyed. >> reporter: now there's a danger of aftershock. nearer the epicenter, a girl's school was struck.
at least 12 students were killed trying to rush out. some were taken to the hospital. people here are poor and deprived in the best of times. in the pakistan border city, several houses collapsed, earthquakes hit the poor far more than the rich because their homes are less steadily built. the quake struck hardest in remote mountainous areas of pakistan and afghanistan. there is little precisely information yet as to how many were killed and how great the damage. there is no doubt people will need help, it will be hard to get it to them. >> ifill: authorities in both afghanistan and pakistan say the casualty count is expected to rise as rescuers reach more remote areas. migrants and refugees surged across the balkan states again today, after european leaders held an emergency summit. police in croatia said more than 13,000 people have crossed its
eastern border with serbia within the past 24 hours. and nearly 10,000 moved on from croatia, westward to slovenia. meanwhile, in brussels, european union leaders said they committed early today to bring order to the chaos. >> the only way to restore order to the situation is to slow down the uncontrolled flow of people. the the flow of people to neighboring countries has to stop. i want to be clear, people must be legislated. no registration, no rights. >> ifill: the e.u. leaders agreed to accommodate 100,000 people at registration centers, and to give greece more help. meanwhile, the u.n.'s humanitarian office said today, new fighting in syria has displaced at least another 120,000 people. that's more than double an earlier estimate. an anti-migrant faction in poland scored big in sunday elections.
the conservative "law and justice party" celebrated last night after winning an absolute majority in parliament. the group opposes taking in migrants, and adopting the euro currency. conservatives in argentina also did well, as opposition presidential candidate mauricio macri forced a runoff with the ruling party's nominee on sunday. and in guatemala, former tv comedian jimmy morales overwhelmingly won the presidency. he attacked corruption and promised smart phones for children. there's word this evening of a possible two-year budget deal in congress. house and senate aides say it would allow increased spending, despite budget caps, but defense would increase more than domestic programs. white house spokesman josh earnest confirmed the ongoing talks today, but said it is not a done deal. >> we have worked assiduously to protect the privacy and confidentiality of those
discussions. principally because they're based on this principle nothing is agreed to in the context of this conversation until everything is agreed to. and as i stand here today, not everything has been agreed to. that means nothing at this point has been agreed to. >> ifill: without a deal, the government will run out of money on december 11th. any agreement could also include an increase in the federal borrowing limit that expires november 3rd. an oklahoma judge ordered a mental evaluation today for a woman accused of driving her car into a homecoming crowd at oklahoma state university. adaycia chambers is being held on $1 million bond. she faces preliminary counts of second-degree murder. four people died and dozens of others were injured in saturday's crash. chambers' lawyer denied she was drunk or taking drugs at the time. he said she's mentally ill. investigators in vancouver, canada worked today to figure out why a whale watching boat sank.
five british citizens died in sunday's incident. one is still missing. amateur video showed the 65-foot vessel partially submerged, late sunday afternoon off tofino, on vancouver island. rescuers and others rushed to the waterfront to help. >> the outpouring from the community has been phenomenal. people come forward and they're offering everything from food and blankets and clothing to just people to be with people and help them and helping the ambulance, the paramedics, the hospital staff, everything. it's everybody. they come out and say, what can i do? >> ifill: in all, there were 27 people on the boat. remnants of hurricane "patricia" moved along the gulf coast today. heavy rain continued from eastern texas to the florida panhandle, and flash flood alerts were up for several states. meanwhile, texas was starting to dry out after the system dumped more than a foot of rain over the weekend.
the university of mississippi today removed the state flag from its place of honor on campus. the flag includes the confederate battle emblem, and students, faculty and others had urged that it be taken down. university police lowered the banner this morning, and took it to the school's archives. wall street had trouble making any headway today. the dow jones industrial average lost 23 points to close at 17,623. the nasdaq rose nearly three points, and the s&p 500 slipped four. and, the national football league is claiming success with letting people worldwide watch a game online for free, instead of showing it on television. "yahoo" streamed sunday's buffalo - jacksonville game in london, and got more than 33 million views. the league says the experiment proves streaming can become the main means of distribution for more games. still to come on the newshour: the secretary of education rethinks testing in u.s. schools. how eating bacon might cause cancer. an inside look at restoring the work of italy's master painters.
and much more. >> ifill: when it comes to standardized testing in schools, how much is too much? in a policy reversal, the obama administration, which has supported student and teacher assessment, now says testing has gotten out of hand. this weekend, the white house recommended capping testing at 2% of class time. a new report conducted by the council of great city schools found the average student sits for as many as 112 mandatory standardized tests between kindergarten and high school graduation. earlier today, i sat down with the outgoing education secretary arne duncan, and michael casserly, the executive director of the council of the great city schools about the problem, and the proposed solutions.
mr. casserly, secretary duncan, thank you for joining us. secretary duncan, you started talking about the inadequacy of testing and the shortfalls and flaws two or three years ago. what took so long for the education department to embrace this idea today? >> we've embraced the idea for a while. what's different is we actually have data. i have been talking about this for a while, and the president has. we had lot ofen eke dotes and needed to get to a better spot but no one had surveyed the nation. i went to mike about two years ago and said would you be willing to ask your districts what are you doing and it's taken them two years to get together. we're beyond anecdotes now, we have facts, and where there is too much spent on testing, a redundancy of du duplicitous st, we don't want to do that. where we're wasting students
time and adding stress, we want to challenge the stats quo. >> woodruff: somquo. >> ifill: some said the solution is not the solution. the federal government saying you should put a cap on the testing is not the solution to the overtesting that started in the first place. >> i actually agree with that. i think this is a very complicated issue. it involves the time that's devoted to testing, it involves the quality of the test, it involves the redundancy of the test, the use of the test, it involves all kinds of pretty complicated factors. you might solve a little bit of the time problem by putting a time cap on this, but you could also do damage at the same time if you don't address some of the other questions. so if you lowered the cap to say 1%, you could still have redundancy in the test, and you could still have bad tests. there may be less of them. >> ifill: how do you guard against unintended consequences
as happened from the testing? >> well, i think one of the things that all of us have to do now is to have a more thoughtful conversation about what smart assessments would actually be and see if we can figure out some way to cord fate this a lot better -- coordinate this better across federal, state and local entities. one thing that was clear from the research we did on this was that these entities don't necessarily talk to each other, these layers of the education apparatus don't necessarily talk to each other. so we have plenty of examples where people were administering overlapping tests, and kids were actually toggling back and forth from one test to another, when it could have been solved by just having differing layers of government talk to each other a little better. >> ifill: secretary duncan, government talking to each other is not necessarily what government does best. in fact, there are people who say part of the overtesting is as a result of people trying to
meet standards that you were promoting -- race to the top, common core standards and, as a result, you kept layering one test on top of the other. do you feel you have some responsibility about that? >> i think we all do. what i appreciate is this is real leadership in action. this is our major urban school districts coming together and saying we need to do better. this is the state chief officers coming together with us saying we need to do better. it's us being self-reflective and saying we want to be better together. it's the idea in washington people yell and point fingers and say i'm right and everybody else is wrong. i think what we're trying to do is say how do we be a better partner and do better. the goal is to improve instruction every sing daily for the child in classroom. where we're giving good information to parents and teachers and parents, to empower them to build on strengths and work on weaknesses, that's a
good thing. to do things that are redundant are not whenful. it wastes time and energy. >> ifill: it's not just washington. a movement to opt out of these tests started in local school districts and around the country with parents and teachers. how much of that will be satisfied by washington saying do less? >> i think there are two sides to the coin. folks who think we need to do more and more testing, i think is wrong. folks who think we shouldn't do any assessments, that's equally wrong. there is a common sense middle ground. this is an historic rights issue issue. historically in the nation, we swept under the rug the horrific achievement gap between black, white students and latino and white students and poor and wealthier students. too much testing is bad. walking away from assessment is equally bad. let's find the common sense middle ground and strive together. >> ifill: doesn't sound like you have figured out where the sweet spot is, mr. casserly.
>> no, we haven't. part of the goal is to gather data on how much testing was actually done. we haven't figured out the right balance. we figured out we will form a commission to see what the right balance will be, what will models and options for school districts be to present a more rational and intelligent assessment system. >> ifill: in the meantime, there is been a huge explosion of a business model based on testing. don't you anticipate pushback from those companies who have been behind a lot of these? >> i think the answer is yes, of course, we do. we're not naive about. this we don't think just because we put out data about how much testing there is, the publishers are going to go, we never knew, we should stop selling the tests. we don't believe that for a second.
but i think that, in cooperation with the federal government, the department of education, the states and the urban public school systems that we can at least a more intelligence conversation. >> part of the conversation is on the amount and that the an important conversation to have, but that's maybe half of the battle here. the big thing that we have to get to is are these assessments high-quality. for farm, if folks just cut back testing and go to the bubble test, that would be a disaster. we want to be writing to be assessed. that takes time. critical thinking needs to be assessed. to make sure that the high-quality assessments are available in realtime, results two teachers, two parents, two students, so that, again, instruction av improves on a daily and a weekly basis. >> how do you manage the effectiveness? that the another thing. it's one thing to have quality, one thing to have quantity.
but you have to be able to measure learning has been approved and that's been the defense is we need to have that basic line. >> i think the world is changing and it's important historically. gwen, you have 50 different states going 50 different tests which you couldn't compare and cost a heck of a lot money because everyone is doing their own thing. what you now have thanks to mike's leadership and the state chief officers and others leadership, governor's leadership, you have more states working together. the key is how to accelerate the pace overchange. who is doing a fantastic job with english language learners, in inner city communities, navy reservations and look at the scale of best practices. >> ifill: you think it can be effective? >> i know it k. i visit more schools than anybody across 50 states and i see extraordinary work. we met with two teachers earlier today who talked about how the data they're giving is not how to teach to 25 to 30 students in
aggregate but to teach individually in pearnlized way to every single child and help them get to where they need to go. so loot of learning to do -- so a lot of learning going forward. great assessments driving creating and teaching and learning, not in conflict with it. we need to make norm and not the exception. >> ifill: secretary arne duncan, michael casserly, thank you very much. >> thank you. >> ifill: but first, we return to the violence that's lately consuming israel and the palestinian territories. tonight, we focus on one single event involving two young teenage boys on october 12th,
an episode which has triggered more anger and response than any of the others in the latest wave. newshour special correspondent martin seemungal returned to the scene to find out more about happened, and how it has affected the already fractured relationship between local israelis and palestinians. a warning: this report contains some graphic images. >> reporter: the scenes on this street are calm, giving no indication of the violence that happened here. the video is too graphic to show: a 13-year-old boy, on the ground-bleeding, legs contorted. the boy is ahmed manasra, a palestinian; the story leading up to this shocking moment is as disturbing as the video. >> he stabbed a little kid right here. >> reporter: police have accused ahmed and his 15-year-old cousin hassan of stabbing two israelis, one also 13 years old. he was leaving a candy store on his bicycle when he was attacked. police released closed-circuit video footage of what they say are ahmed and hassan running from the scene-armed with knives. minutes later, another camera shows hassan lunging across the train tracks at police, before he is shot and killed. ahmed is pursued by police and a furious crowd.
eyal elbazi was in that crowd. >> what can you do? you see him running up to that area there's a lot of people over there. we thought he is stabbing more people. >> reporter: they caught him at train tracks. >> reporter: according to initial reports, ahmed wound up here on the tracks because he was hit by a car, but the israeli doctors who treated him say his injuries fit the profile of someone who had been struck by a blunt instrument. we may never know, but we do know that the video triggered widespread anger among palestinians. it went viral on social media-- the cellphone video, recorded by an israeli bystander, was viewed millions of times on facebook, complete with background sound of people cursing at him. his father, saleh, says it was unbearable to watch. >> ( translated ): a policeman kicked him on the leg twice. a second israeli calling him names, the third was calling," kill him kill him."
if it was a cat or a dog on the road, you would help it. he was a child, no one helped him. >> reporter: his aunt-mysoun mahane said the video was all over facebook. mysone mahane is ahmed's aunt. >> i was very shocked when i saw the picture. this is the first picture we have seen. we were very shocked. i cried. >> reporter: but elbazi says the video did not tell the whole story. >> after one or two guys were trying to stop him with a knife and his craziness, they beat him up a little bit. yes they beat him up, but a lot of israelis stopped them. enough, enough, enough, >> reporter: and elbazi points out that ahmed did receive medical treatment along with the 13-year-old jewish boy he allegedly stabbed. that boy, simply known as na-or, his full name hasn't been released, stumbled away from the scene and collapsed before paramedics stabilized him.
his family declined to be interviewed. but we spoke to others who know him including his classmates. >> ( translated ): he is a fine boy, a good boy, very sociable, very friendly, he loves everyone we are his friends. he is in our class. >> reporter: well known to the shopkeepers in the neighborhood, gil tzemach says he came to his store often. >> ( translated ): i feel pain for the victim for a boy who basically just came to buy some candy and it could have been me 20 seconds before or after. ahmed is also described as quiet and well liked. his mother showed us these pictures. he is fond of animals, keeps pets, a turtle, and pigeons. none of his friends or family believe ahmed attacked 13-year- old naor with a knife. especially his father. >> ( translated ): a 13-year-old boy is not able to stab anyone. he is not physically strong enough to do it. >> we don't support killing, not for jews, not for israelis. we don't support this of
course.. especially the honest people the innocent people, palestinians or israelis. we don't support this. >> reporter: even elbazi, one of the israeli witnesses to the attack, is finding it difficult to comprehend. but thinks he knows what happened. >> i think 13 year old person doesn't know what to think. i don't think his father knew. i don't think his mother knew. i don't think the family knew about it. i think he did it from facebook or something like that. i don't think his dad would approve something like that. any dad would not approve his son to go and murder people. its not right. its wrong. he's 13 years old, he's not supposed to do that. >> reporter: all this is playing out amid a surge of violence between palestinians and israelis. the story of naor and ahmed is a microcosm of a wider narrative. naor comes from pisgat ze'ev, a jewish settlement in eastern jerusalem. it is built on land captured by
israel in 1967, and is considered illegal under international law. israel disputes that. ahmed comes from the palestinian village of beit hanina. pisgat ze'ev and beit hanina are separated by a highway, but there is also an enormous cultural and religious divide. jews in pisgat ze'ev say they rarely come to beit hanina because they are afraid of being attacked. but there is mistrust and fear on both sides. has it changed attitudes of you and your classmates towards israelis? >> we hate them, yeah. they're bad people. they kill palestinians. >> reporter: 15-year-old mohammed, also from beit hanina and a close friend of ahmed's now-deceased cousin, said he was moved by watching the video. >> he was laying down. he got up. he was... a lot of blood... but they were looking at him and they were not helping him. that felt so bad.
>> reporter: speaking to young people from both sides of this divide, it was hard to imagine a future much brighter than their parents. >> ( translated ): our friend naor was exactly the same age as the palestinian kid who stabbed him. now i hate arabs even more. >> ( translated ): i felt like grabbing a knife and stabbing arabs as revenge. this kid did nothing. he was on his way back home on a bike. and then when i looked at him injured, i felt good watching him being injured. i'm not against all arabs, just bad arabs who commit terrorist attacks. >> reporter: the evening of the incident israeli police raided the manasra home in beit hanina, confiscating phones and belongings. ahmed's cousin was arrested. two nights later police returned following up on reports that palestinians in beit hanina were throwing rocks at cars entering pisgat ze'ev. the police commander delivered a very clear message to ahmed's extended family gathered in the courtyard.
>> ( translated ): if another person comes out and throws a stone or a bottle onto the road, everyone who is standing here, i promise i will break his arms and legs. >> reporter: the stabbing incident also led to acrimony at the highest levels. at one point, palestinian leader mahmoud abbas accused israel of executing young palestinians, referencing the video of ahmed lying on the ground as evidence. prompting a swift and angry response from israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu. he accused abbas of incitement. and produced a video showing ahmed being fed in his hospital bed, ahmed's family said their lawyer was the one feeding him. tareq barghout says he was feeding ahmed jello when someone from the prime minister netanyahu's office arrived. >> ( translated ): i felt disgusted. i put on facebook-- look the battle is now in the media. its not legal. they violated the law, its
illegal to publish a photo of a minor while he is detained. >> reporter: dr. asher salmon is the deputy director of the hospital where ahmed was treated. >> in general, i do prefer that minors would not be videotaped and pictures would not be discharged but in a condition when false data is spread all over the world, that this kid was executed, killed, whatever. so i think it put things in the proper context. >> reporter: hadassah hospital in ein karim in jerusalem prides itself for treating all patients equally-- israelis and palestinians. dr. salmon says they were criticized by some for treating ahmed. >> i did hear words like why do you treat terrorists. terrorists should be killed. and things like that which of course i am not even going to respond to these types of comments. >> reporter: the same policy exists at the hadassa hospital on mount scopus, where 13-year- old naor is being treated. in fact, naor's lead doctor is
arab-israeli, the one who took the father to his son's bedside. >> he knew because i told him i am ahmed eid my name. i guess that he figured that i am not jew, i am arab. it was clear to him. >> reporter: and there were no issues? >> no. >> reporter: ilanit tal is the head nurse on the ward where naor is being treated. she says it is a mixed staff and this recent wave of violence is particularly painful to deal with. >> i'm used to this attack in jerusalem, but not with children. it's difficult to see the children attacking us. it's difficult. you know and children being hurt-- it's different. >> reporter: naor is no longer in critical condition and is expected to be discharged from hospital next week. ahmed was released from hospital but remains under arrest. police are treating him as a terrorist and he is expected to be charged with attempted murder.
for the pbs newshour, i'm martin seemungal in jerusalem. >> ifill: as you've probably heard in a headline or two by now, it was a sobering day for meat lovers, especially in a country that ranks second in the world for eating the most meat. william brangham has the story and some perspective on what you need to know. >> brangham: a new report, released by the world health organization, found that often- beloved processed meats, like hot dogs, sausages, ham and
bacon cause certain types of cancer. prior studies had established links but the w.h.o. report looked at more than 800 studies around the world and was the most prominent to say processed meats cause cancer it also found that eating freshly prepared red meats like steak or pork or lamb "probably" can cause cancer as well. all this is jonathan schoenfeld. he created a notable paper for the american journal of clinical nutrition in 2012 ann about the links between diet and cancer. dr. schoenfeld thank you for doing this. the scare has been put in the country today. if i have a couple of slices of bacon or a turkey sandwich a couple times a week, how worried should i be? >> it's important to recognize what the world health organization did was looked at hundreds of studies and put the evidence from those studies good to show the consumption of processed or red meats was
probably associated with an increase of certain types of cancer. what these studies did was look at the overall risk of cancer. it's hard to say any one piece of bacon or piece of meat would increase your risk of cancer by a certain amount, but in total, you know, these status show that, being one of the people who consumed most amounts of meats or processed foods, could potentially increased your risk of these cancers. >> brangham: when we say processed meats, what are we talking about? >> it's actually a definition that encompasses a variety of different ways to add flavor or to help preserve the meats. so the different studies that the world health organization looked at miffed a slightly different definition of what processed meats meant. so it could be things like salting, it could be adding chemicals to help preserve the food, or to help add flavor to the different foods. >> brangham: is it the
processing of processing itself that causes the problem or the cooking of processed meats? >> you couldn't say and the authors of the reports admit as much. what they look at is the total. the consumption of the processed meat was associated with the increased risk of cancer, but the studies don't allow you to dissect it further and figure out what it is about processed meats that may lead to the increased risk. >> brangham: aknow a lot of people in the attempt to lead a healthier life and eat healthier foods switched to chicken and turkey. if those meats are processed, do the same risks come along with them? >> it's something that's unknown. there is certainly some rationale to think that might be the case, but these studies specifically looked at the processing of red meat and whether or not that posed an increased risk of these types of cancers. >> brangham: my understanding is the w.h.o. now put processed
meats in the same category as cigarettes, and we've seen evidenced to asking, basically, is eating a hot dog now like smoking a cigarette? hem understand what is the level of risk? is that outlandish to say? >> yeah, i think that's a very important point. the world health organization classifies things into their risk categories based upon the level of evidence and not upon the magnitude of risk. so while it may be in the same category as cigarette smoking, the magnitude of the risk associated with processed meats does not nearly compare to the magnitude of risk found with cigarette smoking. what that determination just means is there are numerous studies that have found similar findings. the relative risk for smoking is much higher and unlike the consumption of meats, the consumption of excess cigarettes or tobacco doesn't provide any nutritional benefits.
>> brangham: i see. how comfortable are you with the strength of this science? i mean, the industry and other scientists have said the w.h.o. might be overstating the case a bit. how strongly do you feel this is really a concern we ought to all be worried about? >> i think it's important to understand the strengths and limitation of this type of study and recommendation. i think we can have more confidence in the results because the methodology that is used is looking at not one study by itself but the aggregate findings of many and, indeed, hundreds of studies. but it's important to realize that the magnitude of the effects and the absolute increase and risk with the excess consumption of processed meats of red meat is actually relatively small, especially with other things we can modify in our lifestyle and diet such as cigarette smoking. so, you know, i think it's reasonable to be mindful to have these findings, but -- mindful
oof these findings but i don't think it should warrant an overall change in people's lifestyles at this point. >> brangham: dr. jonathan schoenfeld of harvard medical school, thank you very much. >> thank you. >> ifill: the presidential candidates are working overtime. from a big democratic fundraising dinner in iowa, featuring the newly shrunken field of hillary clinton, bernie sanders and martin o'malley... ...to fresh jabs and counterjabs on the republican side, as frontrunners donald trump and ben carson begin to take aim at each other. >> ben carson is a very-low energy person. actually, i think ben carson is lower energy than jeb, if you want to know the truth. we need strong energy. >> and i don't get into the mud pit and i'm not going to be talking about people.
i will tell you in terms of energy, i'm not sure that there's anybody else running who's spent 18 or 20 hours intently operating on somebody. >> ifill: and last night, vice president joe biden told "60 minutes" that the only reason he did not run for president is that he could not win. >> but you wouldn't have considered running for president unless you thought or had some doubts about hillary clinton. >> not at all. that has nothing to do with it. i've said from the beginning, look, i like hillary. hillary and i get along together. the only reason to run is because i still think i could do a better job than anybody else could do. so what better time for politics monday, with tamara keith of n.p.r. and amy walter of "the cook political report." let's start by talking about donald trump and ben carson who, it appears, are fa about to go after -- are about to go after each other because -- let's take a look at the poll numbers which explain why. all of a sudden they're tied or
i should say ben carson surging in iowa. 28%. donald trump at 19%. in new hampshire the latest cbs poll has donald trump at 38% and carson at 12%. donald trump, amy, when asked about the polls -- and he likes to talk about the polls -- he now thinks the polls, especially in iowa where he's trailing, might be wrong. >> of course, because how could he possibly not be in first place? i think we are now at sort of a new stage in this campaign where we know we still have a very strong group of republican primary voters looking for an outsider. they liked trump earlier this summer, and we've moved on into the fall. you can already start to feel that he may have jumped is shark a little bit. here's starting to wear late thin. >> reporter: i'vthin. >> ifill: i've seen that before. >> here's what i would say to you -- >> ifill: yes. -- this isn't indicative of everything, but looking at data
from iowa, listening to republican voters in a focus group last week, they still like donald trump, let's be very clear, he still has a very important place in this primary field, but what you can start to hear from the republican primary voters is i don't know about the temperament, i don't know if i trust him in that job, hence the rise of ben carson, who is the exact opposite in temperament. >> ifill: let's talk about ben carson's temperament. very calm. he will admit to you he is a very calm person, which is, of course, what donald trump was talking about, but he said some very strong things this weekend. he said abortion is like slavery. he has been very definitive in his conservative views. do people like him? i mean, what explains, i guess, the surge in iowa? >> i think a lot of people who you talk to about why they like ben carson actually like that he's quiet, that he's not this bomb thrower. the interesting thing is a lot
of the things he says, some of the analogies he makes to naziism and other things could be inflammatory, but he says it very quietly. >> ifill: what sort of analogies. >> he says it in his doctor voice. there have been numbers who show people agree what he's saying. >> ifill: republican primary voters? >> we're talk about republican primary voters and also talking about in iowa about a state that is heavily evangelical in the primadry an he is appealing to that sort of very -- he's a very religious person. >> ifill: let's talk about jeb bush because the last time donald trump accused somebody of being low energy, it kind of worked, and donald trump and jeb bush have seen the altitude going out of his balloon ever since. is he pulling back or just reorganizing himself in. >> it is remarkable i think, in most ways, not so much there is an outsider energy fueling these two candidates, carson and
trump, but the most remarkable thing on the republican side is the vacuum on the establishment side. we thought it would be jeb bush. he hasn't lived up to expectations, and no one else has been able to get in the lane as the frontrunner on the establishment side to match up against the front runner on the non-establishment side. jeb bush spent the weekend in houston wit big donors assuringm everything is fine, but the problem with jeb bush, is one, he hasn't been a particularly strong candidate, and number two, he has a message that is not a right message for this moment. he is an establishment candidate talking about his record and accomplishments as governor, when the republican primary voters want an outsider and somebody who will shake up the system. >> ifill: so obviously there are republicans who see an opportunity, among them ted cruz
and marco rubio. >> yes and ted cruz and marco rubio are going for different people. in the betting markets, marco rubio is on the rise. marco rubio in the markets of people who sort of look at the odds in an odd side outsider was now hiring than jeb bush, and he has been building an organization, the same thing very much twriew te true with to has an organization, he has people text in and he even has an app. he is very serious about government organization, and as things start to settle out and his plan is, as things settle out and donald trump loses some of that, that people will go to -- to -- >> ifill:ettes talk about the democrats. in 2007 barack obama went to the dinner in des moines, broke out and next thing you know overwhelmed hillary clinton and won iowa. did they break out this weekend?
>> no. this is not 2007. there wasn't a breakout. but there was a change and you saw bernie sanders that night on saturday night in des moines, and more pointed criticism of hillary clinton than we've seen before. nowhis message is not only i ame candidate talking about income inequality making up the centerpiece of my campaign, but i was there first on issues that are important to progressives and i have been there when it's not convenient. >> ifill: and hillary clinton responded by throwing her arms around barack obama and saying i'm the democrat's democrat. >> absolutely. she learned her lesson from 2007, which was barack obama basically out-organized her and put on a better show, and she was not going to go into that without putting on quite a show.
there was a sea of blue glow sticks for hillary clinton. she made one remark that was a little dig at bernie sanders where she said, you know, people say i'm shouting too much on guns, which is actually an issue that's sort of the toughest issue for bernie, while, you know, people often think women are shouting -- >> ifill: lots of gender references. >> hillary clinton is definitely running as a woman in a way she didn't last time around. >> ifill: let's talk about joe biden. watched him last night on "60 minutes," he gave another emotional interview but said interesting things about why he chose not to run, in particular his and dr. jill biden's assessment of hillary clinton. >> yes, i think what he said quite simply, ying i could win. thcould -- i didn't think i could win. this is a more emotional than logical decision. this wasn't about campaign
finance as much as about a grieving grandfather. >> ifill: he talked about his granddaughter saying, pop, don't go away. >> you had to tear up when you watched him talk about that. it was clear if he wanted to do this, he was running against a calendar that wasn't going to help him, the final filing deadlines were coming, fundraising was going to be very difficult and, fundamentally, in order to beat hillary clinton, he was going to have to take the case to hillary clinton. she wasn't just going to collapse. when you hear people around joe biden, they say he was never going to be that candidate who was going to directly at her. >> ifill: what struck you most? >> the moment you talk about, it was so emotional. also, i think he was watching the reports that he was paying attention to what we were saying about whether he was going to run or not and he thought they're all getting it wrong.
because he hadn't made up his mind. >> finally he decided to get it right. >> ifill: it was an effective and interesting way to do it. amy walter, tamera keith, thank you all. >> ifill: finally tonight, a story of an historic flood, and bringing together ancient craft and modern science to restore masterworks. jeffrey brown reports from florence, italy, for his ongoing series, "culture at risk." >> brown: an artwork brought back to life after nearly 50 years. this is one of five wood panels comprising giorgio vasari's "last supper," a massive painting, some 21 feet long in all, first completed in 1546. and now, after many thought it impossible, approaching a complete restoration.
>> i think that this is probably the only place where you can expect a miracle. >> reporter: cecilia frosinini is overseeing the reconstruction of the last supper at the "opificio della pietra dura," the "opd," in florence, italy. one of the world's foremost institutes of art preservation and restoration. and a place itself forged by tragedy. it's hard to imagine today but in 1966 this famous piazza and much of florence was underwater, with devastating consequences for the art treasures for which this city is so well known. november 1966: days of rain swelled the arno river, sending water mixed with oil and sediment into florence, in the city's worst flood in nearly four hundred years. it was captured in this documentary by filmmaker franco zeffirelli, narrated by actor richard burton and broadcast on
state television. more than 30 people died and thousands of priceless works of art and manuscripts were damaged or destroyed. the disaster inspired an outpouring of support from around the world, enlisting donations and young volunteers, known as "mud angels," to descend upon the city to help clean up the mess. >> ( translated ): here the water reached nearly 20 feet. it was so shocking. and with the water came damage. it moved everything everywhere. >> brown: ludovica sebregondi is art historian at the santa croce church, which sits just a few blocks from the river. parts of the church and its famed museum were completely submerged, including where vasari's last supper hung. it remained underwater for more than 48 hours. another victim: a huge crucifix by cimabue, completed in the thirteenth century, its paint almost completely washed away by the waters.
the damaged crucifix has returned, as have many other works, this time to the museum's higher ground, in case the waters should return. >> ( translated ): many of the artworks have been restored in these 50 years but one has yet to be returned. the most famous of all is "l'ultima cena," the last supper by the vasari. it's a symbol of the flood. >> brown: a symbol because of its size and the extent of its damage. after the waters receded, vasari's work was covered with sheets of fine paper, in an emergency measure to prevent the paint from separating from the wood. that bought time, but for more than 40 years few believed it could be saved in one piece. >> many of the old restorers advised that from their experience, based on their experience, the only possible way was to destroy the wood or at least to try to preserve the wood but to separate in two, to cut in two. >> brown: a decision was made to wait, until new restoration methods gave opd officials confidence they could preserve it in its original form.
and in 2009 the work began. the opd, whose name translates to the "workshop of semi- precious stones," has a storied history itself. dating to the 16th century under the medici family, it produced the finest inlaid mosaic and stonework, using techniques that can still be found at its museum workshop in florence today. in the 20th century, it turned to conservation and, expanding into a renaissance-era fort after the 1966 flood, dramatically broadened its mission and scope. opd director marco ciatti: >> we needed new techniques. mainly the flood was the starting point with the new relationship with science. >> brown: around every corner a work by one master or another: a botticelli here, da vinci's "adoration of the magi" sitting on an easel over there.
and more recent works: an early jackson pollack that's just arrived. it's part museum, part workshop, part hospital for threatened treasures. >> the dark areas are less dense, so that's where paint has been lost, and you can very clearly see the splits between the planks. >> brown: ton wilmering, an expert in wood restoration, showed me a large x-ray image of part of the vasari. wilmering is with the getty foundation, which helped fund the vasari project. for the record, the getty trust supports the newshour's art coverage. >> when the water receded, it pulled some of the paint, it pulled some of the gesso, which is the layer in between the wood panel and the paint, to the bottom. >> brown: you mean the painting literally falls to the bottom. >> it sags. >> brown: it sags, i see. so what are you doing here? you're taking a picture of the painting. >> yeah, we're trying to measure not only the visible image of the painting but also what is
beneath the paint layer. >> brown: raffaella fontana is a physicist, using multi-spectrum scanning techniques to peer beneath the surface of paintings, a non-invasive way to create complex models of their many layers. > > and then there are conservators and restorers that pick up our data and decide how to work on a painting. >> brown: he was a young carpenter just beginning his career when the flood hit. >> ( translated ): knowing how wood reacts is vital for restoration. we cannot restore a painting if we do not know about its structure. woodcraft spans more than centuries, it's millenniums. >> brown: castelli came out of retirement to work on the vasari
paneling. and a key goal of this project is that he not only apply his special knowledge to this individual work, but also train a new generation of restorers. >> ( translated ): working with younger people is a way to stay young, not just as far as the spirit is concerned, but in the activity itself as well. working with younger people means passing on our knowledge, which benefits those of us who provide the knowledge too. >> brown: there is concern here, amid italy's continuing economic troubles, about funding to train and employ this next generation. still, as the 50th anniversary of florence's great flood approaches, cecilia frosinini hopes to have "the last supper" finished and returned to the santa croce museum. >> giving back this painting to the city is a very important symbol. it's a very symbolic act. >> brown: and you're going to make it? you're going to make it in time? >> we are really, really going for the deadline. i think we will make it. >> brown: from florence, italy, i'm jeffrey brown for the pbs newshour.
>> ifill: you can go behind the scenes even more online, where you'll find producer frank carlson's photo essay on the o.p.d. and the santa croce museum. and tomorrow, jeff returns with a second story of culture at risk in italy, this time a 'dying' hilltop town that's coming back to life through engineering and tourism. >> ifill: on the newshour online, we pay tribute to "joy of painting" master bob ross by trying to imitate his "happy trees" in a painting of our own. the late pbs star's official youtube channel released his very first episode from 1983, and we decided to try to follow along with his master class. the result -- you be the judge - - is posted on our home page, pbs.org/newshour tune in later tonight, on "charlie rose", democratic
presidential candidate bernie sanders. and that's the newshour for tonight. i'm gwen ifill. join us online and again here tomorrow evening. for all of us at the pbs newshour, thank you and good night. >> major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> and by the alfred p. sloan foundation. supporting science, technology, and improved economic performance and financial literacy in the 21st century. >> and with the ongoing support of these institutions
announcer: this is "bbc world news." >> funding of this presentation is made possible by the freeman foundation, newman's own foundation, giving all profits from newman's own to charity and pursuing the common good, kovler foundation, pursuing solutions for america's neglected needs, and sony pictures classics, now presenting "truth." >> ladies and gentlemen, dan rather. >> what is our next move? >> i might have something for the election. >> the president may have gone awol. >> he never even showed up. >> parts of the file were being tossed into the wastebasket. >> do you have these documents? >> tonight, we have new information. >> the memos can be re-created. >> they are going to start an investigation.